| Press for Spring of 1903 in pouchtoo |
Movement
Message from Russia to Austria in 'pouchtoo':
It's hard to know where we stand now, unfortunately. I can see two basic ways to go. I could send my A Mos up to Stp, opening the possibility that I am heading for Norway, but then going to Finland instead. Then I'd be ready for Swe-Bal, Fin-Swe, which is a good position for invading Germany. Or I could move Warsaw, putting A Mos into War behind it. And using that plan, I could either go straight War-Pru, or I could do the trickier War-Gal with support, and you'd retreat into Bohemia. Then with A War and A Gal, I could go to Sil and Pru in S04, while you went to Tyrolia, and we'd have a big big attack on Germany. As usual, it's a timing problem, and although I myself am champing at the bit now, I want to make sure I don't destroy England's strategic position by dragging Germany out of France too early. I'll ask England directly, but I think he will say he won't know what timing he wants until he sees the results of the Spring move. (For instance, if he manages to take MAO, he's in great shape even without German help, or if he actually captures Bre or Par, similarly; but if he guesses badly, he'll still have to count on some German support.) Ok, so let's hear your wildly aggressive idea for this season. :) Tsar J
Message from Russia to Germany in 'pouchtoo':
>Now that the builds are up, we can talk. I was worried that Italy might >build A Venice, threatening Munich. I'm glad he built the fleet, >although I hope he does not use it to keep France's hopes alive. I don't think that's what Manus has in mind. I was sorry to see A Vie, but Tri wasn't open so there wasn't much choice. I would like to see Austria try to take advantage of the impending Italian sailing excursion. On the other hand, I would not like to see him very successfully take advantage of it. >About that spare army, tell me how you want this done. I had nothing particular in mind, only wondering whether I might get some help if/when needed. It doesn't really look like you've got a spare one. Well, maybe. I think I won't do any outright attacking this coming season. I can't get any really good position against Austria. I'll try to set up a little first, without tipping the hand too much. Tsar J
Message from Italy to France in 'pouchtoo':
> > Italy: Builds a fleet in Naples. > > France: Builds a fleet in Brest. > Hail the Mediterranean navy! Here I come! You should be able to direct the fleet operations to a large extent. Nap-TYS this turn, of course, but tell me what else you want to see from the sailors this turn and in the future. Hang tight! Manus
Message from Italy to France in 'pouchtoo':
> > Italy: Builds a fleet in Naples. > > France: Builds a fleet in Brest. > Hail the Mediterranean navy! Here I come! You should be able to direct the fleet operations to a large extent. Nap-TYS this turn, of course, but tell me what else you want to see from the sailors this turn and in the future. Hang tight! Manus
Message from Austria to Germany in 'pouchtoo':
Greetings Kaiser, Sorry for the delay in answering, I was out of the office on Friday and don't have email on the weekends. I'm certain you have it correct when you suggest that Russia is keeping all his options open. I can not tell a lie and must admit that I've been telling him to head north, given the alternative, I think that is understandable! However, I've been urging him to head for England rather than you, the main reason being that I wanted to see a northern fleet build, not more armies. Armies can come my way too! As for myself, I'm still in the middle here and see no future in extending myself up to the north while I have threats to the east and west. It is my intention to remove that threat of a two-fronted war as soon as possible. Which way I do it will depend on opportunities that come available. All a northern attack can offer me is a shot at Munich. And we all know just how long I'd last there! At this point, my read on Russia is that he is so slow and cautious about his moves that we may both be able to grab some centers and fortify our lines against him before he makes a move. That would then let us coordinate an attack in a year or two. Bluster a little bit and he'll probably just sit there again! Regards, Kaiser D > Message from [email protected] as Germany to Austria in 'pouchtoo': > > Very interesting builds. If I were paranoid, I'd think Russia and > Austria (with perhaps Italy's help) were about to pounce on me. Of > course, this would cut against Russia's request for Germany's assistance > in an attack on Austria, but maybe the Tsar is just exploring the > options. Any enlightenment you can provide would be most appreciated. >
Message from England to Germany in 'pouchtoo':
> > >14 hours of sleep can work wonders! :) > >>Message from [email protected] as Germany to England in 'pouchtoo': >> >>The eastern front is looking mighty dangerous. RA are deployed to attack >>me, not each other. Italy's build was not the worst, although it means >>the Med will be tough to crack. > > >My read on the A/R builds is that they don't trust each other a lot and may >attack soon. On the other hand, if there is LOTS of trust there, you could >certainly be right. Certainly, we'll see one of these two options happen >after Turkey is gone (which may even mean this turn, of course). All the >more reason to get rid of France ASAP. > >>France, I think, is hoping I'll switch sides. > > >Naturally, but I doubt if you want to get into a protracted war with ME when >there's a potential A/R attack on you in the offing... ;) > >>Mid is still guaranteed, but now you have to use A Picardy. I say, go >>for it. Beyond that, what should we do? > > >I agree with your assessment of the importance of Mid. > >As for anything else, it seems to me that with my moves being obvious: > >F Eng-Mid, s by F Iri & F Nat; >A Pic-Bre; >F Nth-Eng. > >Hohn will have to react to that. He'll probably try to dislodge my army in >Picardy with F Bre & A Par. That could leave Marseilles open for you to try >and take with A Bur. Alternately, we could try to take Paris )although that >would make the move to Mid Atlantic uncertain, so I'd rather not). > >I guess my best guess at this point (I HAVE to get a copy of the board from >somewhere!) would be to take a shot at Marseilles and hope that Hohn leaves >it open. > >Komments? > >King Kal >signoff > >
Message from England to Austria in 'pouchtoo':
>>Message from [email protected] as Austria to England in 'pouchtoo': >> >> >>Greetings King Kal, >> >>As I'm sure you can imagine, the notes have been flying fast and furiously >>down here in the south (except for Sultan Steve who has been strangely >>silent, I wonder why? (<: ). > > >Awestruck? :) > >>Anyway, I'm still trying to solve the problem of being the monkey in the >>middle, the natural solution to which is of course to get my neighbors >>interested in other areas, which of course means Russia in the north and >>Italy in the west. I think I've been fairly successful in this and am >>now quite certain that Italy will head for France and Russia will join me >>in an attack on Germany. While I'm sure you are happy for me, I know that >>this will not be the greatest news that you've ever heard. Certainly >better >>than Russia attacking you, and I'm sure he won't be doing that, but still >>there will be some concern on seeing AIR all moving your way. > > >Oh, I'm just ecstatic that the three of you are all heading west... heh heh. > >>I really don't want to see this develop into some sort of massive 2 on 3 >>or even 3 on 3 stalemate. That's always an unsatisfactory ending to a >>game. A well fought 2-way, or even a 3-way where the players have brought >>themselves to an equilibrium are results I can live with, but I hate large >>draws. I'm also not comfortable being in the middle of IR, even if we are >>all heading north. I don't feel that I have a really solid alliance with >>either of them, and they both stand to get more builds out of this than >>I do, and they'll still be in a position to crunch me between them. Given >>a choice, Italy is my preferred target of the two. He's easier to attack >>and I'm less certain of his intentions, Manus strikes me as the sort who >>might just stab me on a whim at any time. > > >Yeah, I'd sooner be eliminated than be part of a 5 or 6 way draw. As for >Manus, I don't know much about his Dip style other than that he IS a good >player with lots of success in E-Mail Dip. He's certainly one to be wary >of. > >>So, why am I telling you all this? Well, I've discussed things with Russia >>of course in trying to get him moving away from me, and he's mentioned that >>there is some chance of you joining in an attack on Germany, sort of a >>feeding frenzy if you will (<:, but that you have some concerns about >>doing so while Italy is establishing himself in France and building up a >>large fleet force. Personally, I also have some concerns about Russia's >>moving into Germany, and where he's going to go afterwards as I'll continue >>to be a tempting source of centers. So, what I'd really like to see would >>be a scenario along the following lines: >> >>Italy heads for France, which should destroy whatever defensive lines he's >>set up. >> >>Austria and Russia make a move on Germany, probably this fall. >> >>England grabs something from France and joins in against Germany. The >>timing there is up to you, perhaps after the first year? >> >>Before Italy can shore up his home defenses, Austria turns on him. At that >>time, I could also lessen my committment to the German attack, thus slowing >>the Russian gains. >> >>You continue your expansion into France and possibly Germany while I take >>out Italy and Russia moves into Germany, with both of us tempering our >>support so as to keep him from going too quickly. >> >>The builds from Italy will allow me to keep a solid line versus Russia, >>and you will of course have control of the northern seas. France and >>Germany will still be around for a while, but as small beleagured powers, >>and I think that AE coordination could easily put us into a position where >>we could move for a two way ending. A coordinated attack on Russia would >>leave three small powers stuck between the two of us, something we ought to >>able to do quite well from. >> >>Well, that's certainly a lot out of the blue! To put it in a nutshell, >>I'd like to be able to point Russia towards Germany without createing a >>West vs East stalemate that we'll never get out of. My real aim is to >>take out Italy (thus kind of nuking the East concept (<:) and I want to >>be sure that you and I are working together as you would be the >instrumental >>player in forming the West if you saw the need, and as I would like a long >>term ally to work with, and I think we'd make a good pair for it. I also >>think we can hide our degree of cooperation well as we are so far apart >>and an eventual joint move by us should have a good chance of surprising >>Russia. > > >Yeah, that certainly IS a lot out of the blue, but it's quite well thought >out and actually, not all that far from what I have been thinking. I was >waiting until seeing just how quickly France and Turkey were likely to go >down before approaching you about it. I certainly don't want to attack >Germany until I can be sure that I'm not facing an A/I/R juggernaut coming >at me out of the east. > >However, as you rightly point out, if that juggernaut _does_ come about, you >would likely be the odd man out when it came time to reduce the draw. That >makes you my likeliest partner for surviving to endgame (and vice versa!). >With the plan you've outlined here, we can keep the game dynamic and the >board fluid. Like I said, I've already given it some thought. > >Okay, I'm in. Now let's get down to brass tacks. > >Germany is already suspicious about the builds you and Russia made and I'm >afraid he may break off his attack on France to defend against the east. >This leaves me either facing France on MUCH more even terms than I am now >(which means taking that much longer to eliminate him) OR taking France down >with Manus' help and having to give Italy a much larger share of the pie >than I'm comfortable with. I need to know that France will be effectively >gone by the end of this year. Without Germany's help, this just ain't gonna >happen. > >Therefore, my question is: what are the odds of you and Russia holding off >on a German hit until the Fall? > >Komments? > >King Kal >signoff > >
Message from England to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
Ah! Feels good to have 14 hours of sleep under my belt.... ;) >Message from [email protected] as Russia to England in 'pouchtoo': > > >Yeah, but if I'm going to try to occupy Swe and Fin, then I have to start >getting the new army into position. So should I build A Stp and move it to >Fin? Or build in Moscow, in order to temporize? Germany has written me in a mild panic believing that the builds you and Austria made are a direct threat to him. I'm going to try to assuage his fears, but I may not be able to. My biggest concern over this, of course, is whether or not he will give up the attack on France. I imagine he'll keep going, but maybe not with as much committment. In any event, even though he is "forewarned", I can't see him breaking off the attack on Hohn to cross the Pru-Tyo corridor himself. That said, I'd still like to see you and Austria "temporize" a bit first. Komments? King Kal?
Message from Turkey to Russia, Austria and Italy in
'pouchtoo': Hello. I wish to offer my services. If I may be of any help, let me know. Steve
Message from Austria to Russia, Italy and Turkey in
'pouchtoo': > > Hello. I wish to offer my services. If I may be of any help, let me know. > Would you mind awfully parachuting into Berlin for me? Thanks!
Message from Austria to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
Hi Jamie, I've heard from Kal and it was a fairly positive response, but his big concern is that Germany is scared by our builds and will pull back. He wants to know what the chances are of us holding off on the attack. Since we've already agreed that that is probably best, it seems fine to me to let Kal know that we will do so. The question is, should we let him know that we'll be conducting a phony war as well, or just explain it after the fact? The second question is how to convince Germany that we are not going to attack him. One idea is for me to suppossedly ask England for help against you, and for England to pass this tidbit on as a reason for Germany not to worry. What do you think? I'll wait to hear from you before responding to England. Kaiser D
Message from Russia to Austria in 'pouchtoo':
Glad I got that, because I was just about to send something to England. He told me the same thing, his concerns about German concerns. Look, it's very hard to believe that John would really decide to stop attacking France just because of your build and mine. He'd be giving up any chance of growing. He's got to gamble, I think. But why am I telling *you* this? Anyway, I do think we ought to tell England only that we will be happy to delay any attack on Germany. I'll tell him I intend to pull the trigger in S04, and that he (Cal) ought to have a good opportunity to stab Germany in F04. Also that I expect you will be sticking the knife into Italy at the same time, S04 or so, so that Cal doesn't have to worry about an Italian navy knocking on the doors of Gibraltar. Let's NOT mention the phony war to England, if that's ok with you. I'll use this as an opportunity to put my A Mos into Stp, since that is probably a reasonably good way to convince Germany that my preferred target is England, not Germany. And sure, your idea of 'asking England' for help against me, which King Kal could then decline politely and mention to Germany, is fine by me. Your call. Once I hear from England again, so I can settle my plan for the A Mos definitely, I'll get back to you and we can make a final plan for movement this season. And for next season too, I guess. Tsar J
Message from Russia to England in 'pouchtoo':
Hi Cal. That's funny, when I wrote you that recent "rest time is over!" I had no idea that you really were trying to catch up on sleep, I just meant that everyone seemed to be taking a little break while the Judge was down. Ok, so Germany is concerned. Austria told me the same thing (that Germany is concerned). I think, then, that I probably *should* order Mos-Stp. And I will *not* order any armies in Germany's direction. So the Spring move should allay his fears, to some extent, since the move to Stp looks a lot more anti-British than anti-German. I agree with you about timing; will try to time things so that my push against Germany comes in S1904. That ought to give Italy time to slice the French hamstrings, and give you time to grab at least one French center. It would be very, very nice if Germany didn't get a build this coming year. But in any case, as I am imagining it, I would attack Germany in S04, and as he shifts his forces against me you could jump in and steal something >from him in F04. And, Austria will be just itching to stab at Italy's weak side, so you won't have to worry about a big navy confronting you at Gibraltar either. Sound good? Tsar J
Message from Austria to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
> But why am I telling *you* this? >> Anyway, I do think we ought to tell England only that we will be happy to > delay any attack on Germany. I'll tell him I intend to pull the trigger in > S04, and that he (Cal) ought to have a good opportunity to stab Germany in > F04. Also that I expect you will be sticking the knife into Italy at the > same time, S04 or so, so that Cal doesn't have to worry about an Italian > navy knocking on the doors of Gibraltar. Let's NOT mention the phony war to > England, if that's ok with you. > That's fine. > I'll use this as an opportunity to put my A Mos into Stp, since that is > probably a reasonably good way to convince Germany that my preferred target > is England, not Germany. > Good. > > And sure, your idea of 'asking England' for help against me, which King Kal > could then decline politely and mention to Germany, is fine by me. Your > call. > I think I'll suggest the idea to him as a possibility for him to use and leave it up to him. > Once I hear from England again, so I can settle my plan for the A Mos > definitely, I'll get back to you and we can make a final plan for movement > this season. And for next season too, I guess. > Sounds good. Final plans for next season can wait until the results are in for this one of course, but a general idea of where we are going would be good. Kaiser D
Message from Italy to Austria and Russia in
'pouchtoo': I don't know, do we want an extension? With the judge out like a light for so long, and with me having had no time to send press anyway. But in the main our moves are already known. I do, however, want to know some of the details about the A/R move north. About when do you guys plan to arrive where? Dave: do we want my Tyr unit to move to Ven and bounce? Should it go to Pie? To Vie and bounce? Support you into Boh? Need to know. The take of Smy is a given. Jamie, will you be supporting me in? I suppose I'd rather take with the army and start moving the fleet back west, but then my army is stranded and is only one unit protecting 2 SC's (not that I don't trust you guys not to get greedy, but I'd like to hear some alternatives to cooping up two Italian units that far west when the job is done. A real big DMZ would be nice, perhaps? Manus
Message from Italy to France in 'pouchtoo':
Did you get my message? Did you get my message? Did you get my message? :-) Manus
Message from France to Italy in 'pouchtoo':
Manus, > Message from [email protected] as Italy to France in 'pouchtoo': > Did you get my message? > Did you get my message? > Did you get my message? > :-) Yes, yes, yes! ;-) NAP-TYS would be great. If you can afford ION-TUN as well, great also. If not, I understand. I am prioritizing slowing the English down, not only because I view him as my primary betrayer, but also because I think that stopping him >from getting into the Med is in your greatest interest, and since you are my primary ally, I want to do everything possible to help you out. If Germany manages to outguess me this year, so be it; maybe we can work on kicking him out, eventually. To that end, what do you want to do with TYR? Can you spare a move to PIE? If so, that will make it easier to defend/retake MAR in fall. Depending on how things look, I might even ask you to come into MAR in fall, as I'd rather you have it than Cal or John, if worse comes to worst. Please let me know your thoughts. Hohn P.S. Jamie's build was disappointing. I thought he was going to build STP(nc).
Message from Italy to France in 'pouchtoo':
> NAP-TYS would be great. If you can afford ION-TUN as well, great > also. If not, I understand. > My best guess is you get both. > I am prioritizing slowing the English down, not only because I view > him as my primary betrayer, but also because I think that stopping him > from getting into the Med is in your greatest interest, and since you > are my primary ally, I want to do everything possible to help you out. > I love you like a brother. > If Germany manages to outguess me this year, so be it; maybe we can > work on kicking him out, eventually. > Count on it! I'm working on getting some pressure put on John. > To that end, what do you want to do with TYR? Can you spare a move to > PIE? If so, that will make it easier to defend/retake MAR in fall. > Depending on how things look, I might even ask you to come into MAR in > fall, as I'd rather you have it than Cal or John, if worse comes to > worst. > I'm still wondering what to do with Tyr. I'll do Pie if I can, but of course I won't take Mar unless you really want me to. It's bad timing or I could pass thru it in Spring on my way to Bur to support you wherever you are, etc., etc. > Please let me know your thoughts. > Atsa them. Manus
Message from Austria to Austria and Russia in
'pouchtoo': > Dave: do we want my Tyr unit to move to Ven and bounce? Should it go to Pie? > To Vie and bounce? Support you into Boh? Need to know. > Perhaps you can head for Munich and try to sell Hohn that your fleets are coming to help? That might just give you an extra turn before he reacts, especially if you don't do it before the moves but after, then apologize for not having had the time to hash it out before hand? > The take of Smy is a given. Jamie, will you be supporting me in? I suppose > I'd rather take with the army and start moving the fleet back west, but then > my army is stranded and is only one unit protecting 2 SC's (not that I don't > trust you guys not to get greedy, but I'd like to hear some alternatives to > cooping up two Italian units that far west when the job is done. A real big > DMZ would be nice, perhaps? > I'd certainly like to see the fleets going west. All of us getting out of the area is fine by me, I have no centers in Turkey anyway. When we start those armies north I think we can empty things out a bit. Maybe park the Russian fleet in Ank and set up a permanent bounce with Italy from Smy and me from Bul? Really it's up to you two as you have the units in place, but I think we want to get everything to the front lines that we can move there. Kaiser D
Message from Austria to Austria and Russia in
'pouchtoo': > Dave: do we want my Tyr unit to move to Ven and bounce? Should it go to Pie? > To Vie and bounce? Support you into Boh? Need to know. > Perhaps you can head for Munich and try to sell Hohn that your fleets are coming to help? That might just give you an extra turn before he reacts, especially if you don't do it before the moves but after, then apologize for not having had the time to hash it out before hand? > The take of Smy is a given. Jamie, will you be supporting me in? I suppose > I'd rather take with the army and start moving the fleet back west, but then > my army is stranded and is only one unit protecting 2 SC's (not that I don't > trust you guys not to get greedy, but I'd like to hear some alternatives to > cooping up two Italian units that far west when the job is done. A real big > DMZ would be nice, perhaps? > I'd certainly like to see the fleets going west. All of us getting out of the area is fine by me, I have no centers in Turkey anyway. When we start those armies north I think we can empty things out a bit. Maybe park the Russian fleet in Ank and set up a permanent bounce with Italy from Smy and me from Bul? Really it's up to you two as you have the units in place, but I think we want to get everything to the front lines that we can move there. Kaiser D
Message from Russia to Italy and Austria in
'pouchtoo': Tovarishe, >I do, however, want to know some of the details about the A/R move north. >About when do you guys plan to arrive where? I think the current plan is to arrive on G's doorstep in about a year. To be honest, while Dave and I have been talking about it a little, (a) we don't have a perfectly definite plan, and (b) I don't think you (Manus) really need to know any details, and just as a general policy I'd rather not have you know too much. (Otherwise when John makes the brilliant guess I just know he will make, I will have to suspect that Manus spilled the beans. :-) ) >The take of Smy is a given. Jamie, will you be supporting me in? I would like to support you in the *Fall*, if you don't mind. The reason is that I would prefer not to see Turkey retreat to Armenia in the Summer, since I would then have to spend another unit preventing him >from going to Sevastopol. Is that ok? > I suppose >I'd rather take with the army and start moving the fleet back west, but then >my army is stranded and is only one unit protecting 2 SC's (not that I don't >trust you guys not to get greedy, but I'd like to hear some alternatives to >cooping up two Italian units that far west when the job is done. A real big >DMZ would be nice, perhaps? I got confused in the middle. By 'west' did you mean 'east'? And why *two* Italian units? Since you don't have a whole lot of units, I'm afraid you are going to have to either trust me, or trust Dave, or forget about taking French centers. But it's up to you, of course. Any way you want to do it is fine with me. I certainly don't intend to leave more than a single unit in the Turkey vicinity myself. Then again, I only have one of the centers (he said resentfully). Tsar J
Message from Italy to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
> (b) I don't think you (Manus) > really need to know any details, and just as a general policy I'd rather > not have you know too much. (Otherwise when John makes the brilliant guess > I just know he will make, I will have to suspect that Manus spilled the > beans. :-) ) > I guess the only reason I'm asking is to make sure that you're talking about it and that Dave has something definite to do with Tri. Those Venetians are a little paranoid, perhaps. > I would like to support you in the *Fall*, if you don't mind. > The reason is that I would prefer not to see Turkey retreat to Armenia in > the Summer, since I would then have to spend another unit preventing him > from going to Sevastopol. > > Is that ok? > That's fine. We can just HOLD for the Spring. > > I suppose > >I'd rather take with the army and start moving the fleet back west, but then > >my army is stranded and is only one unit protecting 2 SC's (not that I don't > >trust you guys not to get greedy, but I'd like to hear some alternatives to > >cooping up two Italian units that far west when the job is done. A real big > >DMZ would be nice, perhaps? > > I got confused in the middle. > > By 'west' did you mean 'east'? > Right. > And why *two* Italian units? > An army and a fleet would be there. As I say, I'd rather not coop up a third of my units in the west -- er, east! -- when there's nothing to do there. > Since you don't have a whole lot of units, I'm afraid you are going to have > to either trust me, or trust Dave, or forget about taking French centers. > But it's up to you, of course. Any way you want to do it is fine with me. > Trusting both of you is my plan, and that's why I was suggesting we DMZ and I can take Smy with the army and push my fleets west. > I certainly don't intend to leave more than a single unit in the Turkey > vicinity myself. Then again, I only have one of the centers (he said > resentfully). > It's that resentful attitude I'm worried about, Mister. :-) (But seriously, if you had an issue with the division of the spoils, let's talk about it!) Manus
Message from Italy to Austria and Russia in
'pouchtoo':
> (b) I don't think you (Manus)
> really need to know any details, and just as a general policy I'd rather
> not have you know too much. (Otherwise when John makes the brilliant guess
> I just know he will make, I will have to suspect that Manus spilled the
> beans. :-) )
>
I know this had been mentioned before, and I don't want to seem like I'm
asking for privileged information ('cause you know me; I'm such a snake!
in the grass! :-) but my main concern was simply whether Tyr needs to help
you guys out or, well, basically, *what* TYR should be doing this turn.
Everyone in the west wants to see it go to Piedmont. The Venetians wouldn't
mind that much, but I need to know how Trieste is set for Spring.
> >I'd rather take with the army and start moving the fleet back west, but then
> >my army is stranded and is only one unit protecting 2 SC's (not that I don't
> >trust you guys not to get greedy, but I'd like to hear some alternatives to
> >cooping up two Italian units that far west when the job is done. A real big
> >DMZ would be nice, perhaps?
>
> I got confused in the middle.
>
> By 'west' did you mean 'east'?
>
Right.
> And why *two* Italian units?
>
An army and a fleet would be there. As I say, I'd rather not coop up
a third of my units in the west -- er, east! -- when there's nothing to
do there. 'Druther get the fleet moved west now rather than after another
turn. Don't want to get there and find out I'm one tempo behind.
> Since you don't have a whole lot of units, I'm afraid you are going to have
> to either trust me, or trust Dave, or forget about taking French centers.
> But it's up to you, of course. Any way you want to do it is fine with me.
>
Trusting both of you is my plan, and that's why I was suggesting we DMZ and
I can take Smy with the army and push my fleets west.
> I certainly don't intend to leave more than a single unit in the Turkey
> vicinity myself. Then again, I only have one of the centers (he said
> resentfully).
>
It's that resentful attitude I'm worried about, Mister. :-)
(But seriously, if you had an issue with the division of the spoils, let's
talk about it!)
Manus
Message from Russia to Italy in 'pouchtoo':
>Trusting both of you is my plan, and that's why I was suggesting we DMZ and >I can take Smy with the army and push my fleets west. Fine. >It's that resentful attitude I'm worried about, Mister. :-) >(But seriously, if you had an issue with the division of the spoils, let's >talk about it!) No, not at all. Under the circumstances. Listen, I just got mail from Dave, it was obviously intended to be PRESS TO RI, but he typed PRESS TO RA. I'll tell him to resend it. Tsar J
Message from Russia to Austria in 'pouchtoo':
Dave, I just got this: >========================================================================== > >Message from [email protected] as Austria to Austria and Russia in >'pouchtoo': [etc.] but obviously you intended to type "press to ri" and typed "press to ra" instead. I've informed Italy, but didn't pass on the content to him, so you might resend it. Tsar J
Message from Italy to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
> >Trusting both of you is my plan, and that's why I was suggesting we DMZ and > >I can take Smy with the army and push my fleets west. > > Fine. > Okay, I'll push the long wood hard left this turn and leave the army in place for a fall take of Smy. And I'll depend on the good faith of my allies that my Turkish holdings are kept sacrosanct. However, just like you don't want to move into Germany too fast, I don't want to move west so fast that any turn we make on Dave in the future can't be done without a lot of mess. > Listen, I just got mail from Dave, it was obviously intended to be PRESS TO > RI, but he typed PRESS TO RA. I'll tell him to resend it. > Thanks. Manus
Message from Russia to Italy in 'pouchtoo':
>Okay, I'll push the long wood hard left this turn and leave the army in place >for a fall take of Smy. And I'll depend on the good faith of my allies that >my Turkish holdings are kept sacrosanct. Ok. > However, just like you don't want >to move into Germany too fast, I don't want to move west so fast that any turn >we make on Dave in the future can't be done without a lot of mess. Uhhh..... Too many negatives for me to parse! Ok, I got it now. I think the key will be to time it properly, so that you can get over and grab a French center or two, but Dave doesn't have a chance to grab German centers. This will be the tricky part. If he gets more centers, it may be quite difficult to stab him effectively, no matter where your units are. And of course at *some* point, if all goes according to plan, at least one of us is going to have to start worrying about England.... Tsar J
Message from Italy to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
Right-O! Or should that be "Not not right-o!" :-) Manus
Message from Austria to Russia and Italy in
'pouchtoo':
Okay, Jamie just told me that my bumbling fingers sent the last response
to ra instead of ri. I already deleted the ACK, but no big deal. My
thoughts on things below:
> > (b) I don't think you (Manus)
> > really need to know any details, and just as a general policy I'd rather
> > not have you know too much. (Otherwise when John makes the brilliant guess
> > I just know he will make, I will have to suspect that Manus spilled the
> > beans. :-) )
> >
> I know this had been mentioned before, and I don't want to seem like I'm
> asking for privileged information ('cause you know me; I'm such a snake!
> in the grass! :-) but my main concern was simply whether Tyr needs to help
> you guys out or, well, basically, *what* TYR should be doing this turn.
> Everyone in the west wants to see it go to Piedmont. The Venetians wouldn't
> mind that much, but I need to know how Trieste is set for Spring.
>
Go to Pie if you desire. The one suggestion I had was to do Tyr - Mun
in the spring and to try and suggest to Hohn that you were moving the
fleets west to support him. I suppose you could equally suggest that
you moved to Pie to support Mar, might be a little harder to sell.
Trieste is just happy as can be. They hate to swim and wouldn't know
what to do in those canals (<:.
Frankly, I'll run on the need to know principle as well. If I REALLY
need to by in Tyr, I'll support myself there, but I don't think it's an
issue, so do as you will, but we'll rule out any foray's towards each
other's territory.
> > >I'd rather take with the army and start moving the fleet back west, but
then
> > >my army is stranded and is only one unit protecting 2 SC's (not that I
don't
> > >trust you guys not to get greedy, but I'd like to hear some alternatives to
> > >cooping up two Italian units that far west when the job is done. A real
big
> > >DMZ would be nice, perhaps?
> >
> > I got confused in the middle.
> >
> > By 'west' did you mean 'east'?
> >
> Right.
>
> > And why *two* Italian units?
> >
> An army and a fleet would be there. As I say, I'd rather not coop up
> a third of my units in the west -- er, east! -- when there's nothing to
> do there. 'Druther get the fleet moved west now rather than after another
> turn. Don't want to get there and find out I'm one tempo behind.
>
> > Since you don't have a whole lot of units, I'm afraid you are going to have
> > to either trust me, or trust Dave, or forget about taking French centers.
> > But it's up to you, of course. Any way you want to do it is fine with me.
> >
> Trusting both of you is my plan, and that's why I was suggesting we DMZ and
> I can take Smy with the army and push my fleets west.
>
This sounds right to me. I think you need those fleets heading west
(towards MAO) as fast as possible, so using just the army in Turkey
makes sense. That Turkish retreat does look annoying, waiting till
fall sounds smart, but that's up to you two.
> > I certainly don't intend to leave more than a single unit in the Turkey
> > vicinity myself. Then again, I only have one of the centers (he said
> > resentfully).
> >
> It's that resentful attitude I'm worried about, Mister. :-)
> (But seriously, if you had an issue with the division of the spoils, let's
> talk about it!)
>
Yeah, I've always had a hankering to visit London. I've been to a fair
part of the continent, but never there. Will you convoy me there some
time later?
Kaiser D
Message from Russia to Italy in 'pouchtoo':
>Right-O! > >Or should that be "Not not right-o!" :-) "I would hate to see it turn out that we had a great deal of trouble preventing left-o!" Tsar J
Message from Russia to Austria and Italy in
'pouchtoo': Yeah, that was basically it, Dave, except that in this second version you deleted the part where you said: "Frankly, Manus, I plan to stab you as soon as your fleets are out of position, and I don't give a damn what the helpless and worthless Tsar J thinks." Well, I was shocked, I don't mind telling you! So I'm glad you deleted that part. Tsar J
Message from Italy to Russia and Austria in
'pouchtoo': And now it was JAMIE'S turn to misaddress a message -- to AI rather than AR. :-) Manus
Message from Russia to Austria and Italy in
'pouchtoo': Ooops! Oh well, ha ha, no harm done!Tsar J >And now it was JAMIE'S turn to misaddress >a message -- to AI rather than AR. :-) > >Manus
Message from England to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
Just a quick note til I can get to my other mail. I've thought it over and I really DON'T want you to move to St Pete's. Reasons? 1- If you move there, it forces me to show at least SOME military reaction, or 2- Our alliance will be revealed far too early and I'll lose all credibility with Germany. More later Cal >Message from [email protected] as Russia to England in 'pouchtoo': > >Hi Cal. > >That's funny, when I wrote you that recent "rest time is over!" I had no >idea that you really were trying to catch up on sleep, I just meant that >everyone seemed to be taking a little break while the Judge was down. > >Ok, so Germany is concerned. Austria told me the same thing (that Germany >is concerned). > >I think, then, that I probably *should* order Mos-Stp. And I will *not* >order any armies in Germany's direction. So the Spring move should allay >his fears, to some extent, since the move to Stp looks a lot more >anti-British than anti-German. > >I agree with you about timing; will try to time things so that my push >against Germany comes in S1904. That ought to give Italy time to slice the >French hamstrings, and give you time to grab at least one French center. It >would be very, very nice if Germany didn't get a build this coming year. >But in any case, as I am imagining it, I would attack Germany in S04, and >as he shifts his forces against me you could jump in and steal something >from him in F04. And, Austria will be just itching to stab at Italy's weak >side, so you won't have to worry about a big navy confronting you at >Gibraltar either. > >Sound good? > >Tsar J >
Message from Austria to Austria and Italy in
'pouchtoo': press to T Okay Sultan, that tears it. That Russian fossil is leaking my plans to the Italians. I'm in, let's go get him. Germany and England are in too, they're all tired of him. And imagine the look on Italy's face when he goes to attack France and suddenly France has no other enemies and sinks those fleets like little toy boats. Bwah haaa haaa. Shhhh, don't tell them though...
Message from Italy to Austria, Italy and Russia
in 'pouchtoo': press to m Hey! Dave and Jamie are gonna stab me! Unfair! Can you stop them? Pleeeeaasssee!!?! Manus
Message from Germany to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
Tsar J: Obviously, I am fully engaged, so if you intend to sit and watch for a turn, that will suit me well. I don't expect to knock France out quickly, but I do need to make some headway before turning to other things. Hohn is tough, as you know. The Kaiser
Message from Germany to Austria in 'pouchtoo':
According to rumor, you are correct about Russia's immediate intentions, ie, sit tight. Earlier, he told me he was worried about Early Leader Syndrome. It's still a worry for him. If you find it to your advantage to go against Italy, I will be eager to help. I did not appreciate his interference, feeble though it was, last year. The Kaiser (north)
Message from Germany to England in 'pouchtoo':
Russia says he wants to sit tight for a turn. Austria seems inclined to expect as much. My read is that they are eyeing one another warily. I don't think they will attack me this turn. Italy will probably move to Piedmont and Tyrrhenian, so as to grab Marseilles. It's really the only thing he has going. Russia says he hopes Austria will take advantage. I have no reason to expect Austria will. This could be the year of the Phony War in the East. Use all your forces to take Mid. I will take a shot at Marseilles or something. Are you sure, though, that you want to order ech-mid, nth-ech rather than, say, iri-mid? Russia is making up his mind which way to go. I would not want to leave tempting targets lying around, ie, Norway if mos-stp. The Kaiser
Message from Austria to Germany in 'pouchtoo':
> > According to rumor, you are correct about Russia's immediate intentions, > ie, sit tight. Earlier, he told me he was worried about Early Leader > Syndrome. It's still a worry for him. > > If you find it to your advantage to go against Italy, I will be eager to > help. I did not appreciate his interference, feeble though it was, last > year. > My thanks for the information and the offer. The way rumors seem to flow around this board, you will not take it amiss I hope if I keep my plans to myself at this point. If I don't tell you, I can't blame you for passing them on! Anyway, you should be free to continue hammering France. Regards, The Southern Kaiser
Message from England to Germany in 'pouchtoo':
Don't know if this got thru before the crash... > > >14 hours of sleep can work wonders! :) > >>Message from [email protected] as Germany to England in 'pouchtoo': >> >>The eastern front is looking mighty dangerous. RA are deployed to attack >>me, not each other. Italy's build was not the worst, although it means >>the Med will be tough to crack. > > >My read on the A/R builds is that they don't trust each other a lot and may >attack soon. On the other hand, if there is LOTS of trust there, you could >certainly be right. Certainly, we'll see one of these two options happen >after Turkey is gone (which may even mean this turn, of course). All the >more reason to get rid of France ASAP. > >>France, I think, is hoping I'll switch sides. > > >Naturally, but I doubt if you want to get into a protracted war with ME when >there's a potential A/R attack on you in the offing... ;) > >>Mid is still guaranteed, but now you have to use A Picardy. I say, go >>for it. Beyond that, what should we do? > > >I agree with your assessment of the importance of Mid. > >As for anything else, it seems to me that with my moves being obvious: > >F Eng-Mid, s by F Iri & F Nat; >A Pic-Bre; >F Nth-Eng. > >Hohn will have to react to that. He'll probably try to dislodge my army in >Picardy with F Bre & A Par. That could leave Marseilles open for you to try >and take with A Bur. Alternately, we could try to take Paris )although that >would make the move to Mid Atlantic uncertain, so I'd rather not). > >I guess my best guess at this point (I HAVE to get a copy of the board from >somewhere!) would be to take a shot at Marseilles and hope that Hohn leaves >it open. > >Komments? > >King Kal
Message from England to Austria in 'pouchtoo':
Don't know if this got thru before the crash. >>Message from [email protected] as Austria to England in 'pouchtoo': >> >> >>Greetings King Kal, >> >>As I'm sure you can imagine, the notes have been flying fast and furiously >>down here in the south (except for Sultan Steve who has been strangely >>silent, I wonder why? (<: ). > > >Awestruck? :) > >>Anyway, I'm still trying to solve the problem of being the monkey in the >>middle, the natural solution to which is of course to get my neighbors >>interested in other areas, which of course means Russia in the north and >>Italy in the west. I think I've been fairly successful in this and am >>now quite certain that Italy will head for France and Russia will join me >>in an attack on Germany. While I'm sure you are happy for me, I know that >>this will not be the greatest news that you've ever heard. Certainly >better >>than Russia attacking you, and I'm sure he won't be doing that, but still >>there will be some concern on seeing AIR all moving your way. > > >Oh, I'm just ecstatic that the three of you are all heading west... heh heh. > >>I really don't want to see this develop into some sort of massive 2 on 3 >>or even 3 on 3 stalemate. That's always an unsatisfactory ending to a >>game. A well fought 2-way, or even a 3-way where the players have brought >>themselves to an equilibrium are results I can live with, but I hate large >>draws. I'm also not comfortable being in the middle of IR, even if we are >>all heading north. I don't feel that I have a really solid alliance with >>either of them, and they both stand to get more builds out of this than >>I do, and they'll still be in a position to crunch me between them. Given >>a choice, Italy is my preferred target of the two. He's easier to attack >>and I'm less certain of his intentions, Manus strikes me as the sort who >>might just stab me on a whim at any time. > > >Yeah, I'd sooner be eliminated than be part of a 5 or 6 way draw. As for >Manus, I don't know much about his Dip style other than that he IS a good >player with lots of success in E-Mail Dip. He's certainly one to be wary >of. > >>So, why am I telling you all this? Well, I've discussed things with Russia >>of course in trying to get him moving away from me, and he's mentioned that >>there is some chance of you joining in an attack on Germany, sort of a >>feeding frenzy if you will (<:, but that you have some concerns about >>doing so while Italy is establishing himself in France and building up a >>large fleet force. Personally, I also have some concerns about Russia's >>moving into Germany, and where he's going to go afterwards as I'll continue >>to be a tempting source of centers. So, what I'd really like to see would >>be a scenario along the following lines: >> >>Italy heads for France, which should destroy whatever defensive lines he's >>set up. >> >>Austria and Russia make a move on Germany, probably this fall. >> >>England grabs something from France and joins in against Germany. The >>timing there is up to you, perhaps after the first year? >> >>Before Italy can shore up his home defenses, Austria turns on him. At that >>time, I could also lessen my committment to the German attack, thus slowing >>the Russian gains. >> >>You continue your expansion into France and possibly Germany while I take >>out Italy and Russia moves into Germany, with both of us tempering our >>support so as to keep him from going too quickly. >> >>The builds from Italy will allow me to keep a solid line versus Russia, >>and you will of course have control of the northern seas. France and >>Germany will still be around for a while, but as small beleagured powers, >>and I think that AE coordination could easily put us into a position where >>we could move for a two way ending. A coordinated attack on Russia would >>leave three small powers stuck between the two of us, something we ought to >>able to do quite well from. >> >>Well, that's certainly a lot out of the blue! To put it in a nutshell, >>I'd like to be able to point Russia towards Germany without createing a >>West vs East stalemate that we'll never get out of. My real aim is to >>take out Italy (thus kind of nuking the East concept (<:) and I want to >>be sure that you and I are working together as you would be the >instrumental >>player in forming the West if you saw the need, and as I would like a long >>term ally to work with, and I think we'd make a good pair for it. I also >>think we can hide our degree of cooperation well as we are so far apart >>and an eventual joint move by us should have a good chance of surprising >>Russia. > > >Yeah, that certainly IS a lot out of the blue, but it's quite well thought >out and actually, not all that far from what I have been thinking. I was >waiting until seeing just how quickly France and Turkey were likely to go >down before approaching you about it. I certainly don't want to attack >Germany until I can be sure that I'm not facing an A/I/R juggernaut coming >at me out of the east. > >However, as you rightly point out, if that juggernaut _does_ come about, you >would likely be the odd man out when it came time to reduce the draw. That >makes you my likeliest partner for surviving to endgame (and vice versa!). >With the plan you've outlined here, we can keep the game dynamic and the >board fluid. Like I said, I've already given it some thought. > >Okay, I'm in. Now let's get down to brass tacks. > >Germany is already suspicious about the builds you and Russia made and I'm >afraid he may break off his attack on France to defend against the east. >This leaves me either facing France on MUCH more even terms than I am now >(which means taking that much longer to eliminate him) OR taking France down >with Manus' help and having to give Italy a much larger share of the pie >than I'm comfortable with. I need to know that France will be effectively >gone by the end of this year. Without Germany's help, this just ain't gonna >happen. > >Therefore, my question is: what are the odds of you and Russia holding off >on a German hit until the Fall? > >Komments? > >King Kal
Message from Austria to England in 'pouchtoo':
Hello King Kal, Yes, your original message did get through. Apparently my response did not, and do to a need to clean up my mailbox I just managed to delete the note you just resent me. Doing well, aren't I? Anyway, in a nutshell, I think we are agreed about the way we want things to progress. I am willing to hold off on attacking Germany this year, and I believe that Russia will as well. That should let you get firmly established in France. Regards, Kaiser D
Message from Austria to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
Greetings Tsar, I think that Germany has been mollified and will continue west this year. We need to make sure that we have our moves correctly coordinated. I'm in a rush at work right now, could you please send me your understanding of what we're going to do and I'll let you know if I think any changes are needed. Thanks! Kaiser D
Message from Russia to Austria in 'pouchtoo':
Well, Cal has just told me that he does not want the A Mos to go to Stp. I guess I could try to convince him, but given that moves are due tomorrow I think we'd better just go ahead with the alternative plan. But I don't have any moves plotted out, I'll try to do that later this morning. Tsar J
Message from England to Russia in 'pouchtoo':
>Message from [email protected] as Russia to England in 'pouchtoo': > >That's funny, when I wrote you that recent "rest time is over!" I had no >idea that you really were trying to catch up on sleep, I just meant that >everyone seemed to be taking a little break while the Judge was down. That's what happens when a little aside gets written, but not delivered, for several days. Working two jobs is wearing me down, but I have the odd day here and there to recharge and catch up on "real" life (like working two jobs isn't "real" life... heh heh). >Ok, so Germany is concerned. Austria told me the same thing (that Germany >is concerned). > >I think, then, that I probably *should* order Mos-Stp. And I will *not* >order any armies in Germany's direction. So the Spring move should allay >his fears, to some extent, since the move to Stp looks a lot more >anti-British than anti-German. Which is why I said earlier that, it's so overtly anti-British that I would have to react to it to maintain any credibility with Germany. And right now I very much NEED him against France. >I agree with you about timing; will try to time things so that my push >against Germany comes in S1904. That ought to give Italy time to slice the >French hamstrings, and give you time to grab at least one French center. It >would be very, very nice if Germany didn't get a build this coming year. >But in any case, as I am imagining it, I would attack Germany in S04, and >as he shifts his forces against me you could jump in and steal something >from him in F04. And, Austria will be just itching to stab at Italy's weak >side, so you won't have to worry about a big navy confronting you at >Gibraltar either. As we've agreed, timing is EVERYTHING here, so PLEASE don't give into the temptation to HAVE to be doing something like A Mos-Stp. Your army does not HAVE to go north this turn in order to be in position for an attack on Germany. Right now, the status quo looks okay to Germany and he has even told me that, after corresponding with you and Austria (and I suppose Italy), that he doesn't think he will be attacked this turn. You moving an army north would change all that and destroy my chance for a good stab. Remember the master plan! We have to fiddle for a couple of turns in order for several things to happen: 1) France must be irrecoverably down and with Hohn that pretty much means three or fewer centres; 2) Germany has to be pulled out of position just enough that you have a better shot at him for the initial attack; 3) Italy has to be pulled far enough west that Austria (with a little nudge >from you) cannot resist the temptation any longer (that will be hard enough should he be heavily involved in the attack on Germany); 4) Austria needs to be involved with both Germany & Italy to make our attack on them as easy as possible. There will come a time when Austria, Italy and whatever remains of Germany or France if anything, will all unite against us. We have to make our initial effort as surprising as possible. This final outcome, pretty as it may seem, pretty much relies on our being patient for the next two to three turns. Let's not give it away just when it's crucial. Komments? King Kal
Message from England to Germany in 'pouchtoo':
>Message from [email protected] as Germany to England in 'pouchtoo': > >Russia says he wants to sit tight for a turn. Austria seems inclined to >expect as much. My read is that they are eyeing one another warily. I >don't think they will attack me this turn. I've been trying to pump both of them for any future intentions they may have, without really expecting them to confide in me as regards you, but I also get the same impression that you should be safe for this turn anyway. If they come to any kind of agreement, you may be in trouble but I think you/we have SOME time >Italy will probably move to Piedmont and Tyrrhenian, so as to grab >Marseilles. It's really the only thing he has going. Russia says he >hopes Austria will take advantage. I have no reason to expect Austria >will. This could be the year of the Phony War in the East. Here's hoping Italy isn't there to prop up France, but I suspect not and that you are right; he'll grab at Marseilles. >Use all your forces to take Mid. I will take a shot at Marseilles or >something. Done. >Are you sure, though, that you want to order ech-mid, nth-ech rather >than, say, iri-mid? Russia is making up his mind which way to go. I >would not want to leave tempting targets lying around, ie, Norway if >mos-stp. You're right, but I think I have to take the chance in order to have a shot at a centre for the Fall. I'm going to rely on the Swe-Den bounce tactic to keep me safe for a turn. I assume that's still on? He won't make much progress against me in the north should he decide to stab unless he builds a fleet in Stpnc and I don't see THAT as likely for at least a little while. Kordially, King Kal
Message from Russia to England in 'pouchtoo':
Yep, I have to agree with everything you said. Ok, so I won't order the army to Stp. Tsar J
Message from England to Austria in 'pouchtoo':